Club News

 

User login

New Comments

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

2 days 16 hours ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

2 days 18 hours ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

2 days 20 hours ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

2 days 21 hours ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

3 days 16 hours ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

3 days 22 hours ago

-508 DAF

3 days 22 hours ago

--14c and 401Coventry Climax Fork Lift Truck (1949-64)

3 days 23 hours ago

FRENCH DINKY TALBOT LAGO

3 days 23 hours ago

-Boxes General Discussions including end flaps, both British and French

3 days 23 hours ago

--14c and 401Coventry Climax Fork Lift Truck (1949-64)

2 weeks 4 days ago

--14c and 401Coventry Climax Fork Lift Truck (1949-64)

2 weeks 5 days ago

-508 DAF

1 month 1 week ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 1 week ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 1 week ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 1 week ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 2 weeks ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 2 weeks ago

-508 DAF

1 month 2 weeks ago

-508 DAF

1 month 2 weeks ago

-508 DAF

1 month 2 weeks ago

New arrivals

1 month 2 weeks ago

New arrivals

1 month 3 weeks ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 3 weeks ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 3 weeks ago

ORIGINAL MECCANO DINKY TOYS FACTORY BOX ART 175 HILLMAN MINX SALOON + DRAWING

1 month 3 weeks ago

--29c and 290 Double Decker Bus (1938-63)

1 month 3 weeks ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 3 weeks ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 3 weeks ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 3 weeks ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 3 weeks ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 3 weeks ago

--29c and 290 Double Decker Bus (1938-63)

1 month 3 weeks ago

--29c and 290 Double Decker Bus (1938-63)

1 month 3 weeks ago

DTCAwebsite upgrade 2023

1 month 3 weeks ago

Visitors

  • Total Visitors: 1638534
  • Registered Users: 388
  • Published Nodes: 1681
  • Since: 03/21/2024 - 12:56
122 posts / 0 new
Last post

-501 - 505 and 901 - 905 + 941 & 942 Foden types 1 & 2 (1952-1964) (cont...)

Dinkinius's picture
Dinkinius
Offline
AustraliaDTCA Member

The following are the latest production runs for the Foden's, based on the quality control stamps:
901 April 1957 Last catalogue/price list dated April 1957
902 December 1957 Last catalogue/price list dated May 1959 although the model continued in overseas markets, at least for Australia until January 1960
903 December 1958 Last catalogue/price list dated August 1958, although like the 902 Flat Truck, the model made its last appearance in an Australian catalogue dated August 1959
905 February 1963 continued until it made its last appearance in a catalogue/price list in July 1963
The quality control stamps together with the Sales Order Forms are perhaps the most reliable references in determining production runs, as catalogues generally cover models that Meccano reasonably consider are available through their Agents. With Order Forms, there are many instances when models were out of stock until a new production run was undertaken.
Included in my DINKY NEWS #17 page 9 is a discussion on Production Periods extracting details from the Order Forms for June 1960, February and May 1961 and October-December 1962. The models that were constantly unavailable to order due to no stock were the 252 Refuse Wagon and 982 Pullmore Car Transporter which was unavailable to order in the 1960 and 1961 Order Forms. There were another nine models that were also unavailable during these periods with the 621 unavailable in May 1961 and October-December 1962. The 965 Euclid was unavailable in February and May 1961, this being possibly due to the re-tooling to incorporate window glazing.
Meccano also had to reduce quantities a Sales Agent could order in February 1957, such as the Foden Regent was restricted to an order for only two models, 965 Euclid to one model, and for cars 131 Cadillac to a single trade pack of six models. There were many models that had restrictions placed on the quantities that could be ordered in February 1957. The Fodens apart from the "Regent" had no restrictions so sufficient stock was on hand. (And of course, the 901 was no longer available in the February 1957 Order Form having been replaced by the 934 Octopus although the 901 was still included in the April 1957 catalogue/price list! With a quality control stamp of April 1957 perhaps indicates that even Meccano did not operate under a strict set of deletion rules - with the 934 making its appearance in April 1956, obviously the 901 was continued for a longer period than expected, although the Sales Department were operating under a different set of rules by not including the 901 in the February 1957 Order Form!) But I think I have got well off the track now!!
Bruce

dinkycollect's picture
dinkycollect
Online
DTCA MemberFrance

Rob & Bruce

Many thanks for all this information. Of course things may be slightly different here in Europe from what they were down below.

The dates of availability may be very different from the manufacturing dates, Dinky were still available ten years after the factories closed.

starni999
Offline
DTCA MemberUK

Hi Bruce,
Many thanks for the info on sales ordering etc, it's an area I know very little about, but am fascinated by. Therein lie some of the answers to things that look so strange to us 50 odd years on.
If it's OK with you I'd like to start a new topic specifically on ordering / sales / promotion etc so I can throw a few questions in, and this info can be found easily in the future, and isn't limited to just the Fodens.
Cheers
Chris Warr.

Dinkinius's picture
Dinkinius
Offline
AustraliaDTCA Member

Hello Chris
I couldn't agree more, so have acted accordingly in your new thread!
Returning to the Fodens, when it comes to strange combinations, my immediate thought tends towards suspicion! I realise that this is wrong, but when a part can be easily removed and put onto another model, using utmost care in doing so, we all have to be extremely diligent. The only way an unusual colour combination can be proved 100% correct is if that model was purchased by its current owner when new, off the shelf. As collectors, we should not have to take this measure to prove something, but sadly there are those who can see a quick dollar/pound/euro. I am somewhat surprised with the quantity of 902 Fodens being offered through auction in red and a green back, but red hubs, whereas this variation should have green hubs. It is so easy to change a red 901 to a "scarce" 902.
Not to forget the box. How many boxed models are being offered these days, even through highly respected auctioneers, in a box in which the model was never originally packaged! Perhaps I should start a new thread on THAT topic!!
Bruce

hoort's picture
hoort
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

Hi Bruce,
Thanks very much for the usefull information!
And Chris, I would welcom the start of your proposed new topic
on ordering/sales/promotion.
Rob

janwerner's picture
janwerner
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

Hi, I have no host of rare or pristine Fodens to offer here, but you may like my photo of a would-be combination of contemporaries, of which the Bedford Streamlined Articulated Petrol Tanker was never issued.

If realized, it might well have been issued in December 1948, like the Foden 14-ton Tanker (and its relative, the no. 521 Bedford Articulated Lorry)!
Kind regards, Jan

starni999
Offline
DTCA MemberUK

Hi Jan,
I can't understand why the Streamlined Petrol Tanker was never made, there could have been so many lovely liveries, and later on it could have gained a Commer cab!
CW.

Dinkinius's picture
Dinkinius
Offline
AustraliaDTCA Member

Rob and Chris
Glad you both liked the info I provided recently. As you know, the details I wrote about refer to the UK scene with the exception when I mentioned any differences in Australia. The quality control stamps were of course a factory application, and the Order Forms were those sent to the factory. In Australia, all orders were handled by the Australian Distributor E G Page & Co, Danks Building, 324 Pitt Street, Sydney. I have not obtained examples of any Australian order forms.
There were no restrictions placed on the Meccano Magazine in Australia as far as I am aware with these being available through normal newsagencies. In my home town of Armidale in New South Wales, Dinky Toys and limited Hornby Dublo items were sold in Pidgeons Newsagency and this store also handled magazines (including Meccano Magazine), newspapers, stationery etc. Another similar newsagency in Armidale called Brown's was where my father had a standing order for Meccano Magazine, EAGLE (that was for me!), John Bull/Everybody's and the English Women's Weekly, naturally for my Mother! Brown's did not stock any products from Binns Road.
Bruce

Dinkinius's picture
Dinkinius
Offline
AustraliaDTCA Member

Jan - I too am surprised why Meccano never followed through with the streamlined tanker, having already devoted considerable time in the Drawing Office. One would have thought a decision could have been reached relying on a rough sketch proposal. The only thought I have as to why it did not go into production is the time-frame. The 521 was released in March 1948 and then in September, along came the Foden Tanker. Perhaps Meccano considered the 521 tanker would impact on sales for the 504 Foden Tanker, or producing the 521 entirely in diecast was more expensive than a tinplate tank. A 521 tank would have required considerable tooling compared to the 504 tank, so perhaps cost played a very important role.
Bruce

janwerner's picture
janwerner
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

Hi Bruce, (sorry to get off-topic a little bit) I fully agree, that is exactly what I wrote in my article (16 years ago already!):
A Dinky that never was: Jan Werner tells the story of the never-to-appear Dinky Bedford Articulated Streamlined Petrol Tanker of 1948. In: Model Collector 12:4 (April 1998) pp. 19-28.

Another nice presentation of my tankers, sitting on their original design drawings.
Kind regards, Jan

Dinkinius's picture
Dinkinius
Offline
AustraliaDTCA Member

Jan - what a wonderful set of tankers. Thanks too for reminding me about your original story in Model Collector. I must see if I can find the magazine now! I was using my DINKY NEWS as a reference point but perhaps along the way, I was also delving into what I had read 12 years ago! Yes, we have diverted from the original thread, but we did bring in the Foden tankers, so all is well!
Bruce

hoort's picture
hoort
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

Just a parade of one Foden. It is among the favourites of my collection.
Rob

starni999
Offline
DTCA MemberUK

Hi Rob,
What a lovely colour combination that is, and one I've never seen for real even in poor condition.
Keep the Foden pictures coming, it gives me something to aim for!
Chris Warr.

hoort's picture
hoort
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

This time my real mystery Foden. 503 1st type Tailboard in French blue
with red body, red flash and red hubs. The red hubs make it almost impossible to fake. Found in a job lot in a local UK general sale auction. The price I paid was very low. The box has no date stamp, but shows the correct paint traces. The model is not in the best condition, but looks untampered with. One thing I know for sure: it is not listed. I have never seen one before or after this example. It is the only Foden in my collection which remains a questionmark to me. What do you think?
Kind regards,
Rob

buzzer999's picture
buzzer999
Offline
DTCA MemberUK

Rob, every time I think you have shown us something really special you come up with something better.

This one is amazing.

Dave

hoort's picture
hoort
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

Thanks Dave. It is a pleasure to be a member of this Forum and be able to obtain and share information on our hobby.
Rob

hoort's picture
hoort
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

For the time being this will be my last post in this thread. I will
try to make an article on the Fodens in my collection. With pictures
of all models, including the ones I have posted already.
For now last but not least the 905 Chain Lorry in blue and grey.
It has a rivetted back and the box is dated 1957. Traces of blue paint
in the box suggests model and box have been together from production.
1957 ties in with the final production of the 903 Tailboard in blue en fawn.
In my opinion some of the cab/chassis of this model were used to produce
this rare variation. I bought my example almost three years before the
model appeared in catalogues.
Rob

starni999
Offline
DTCA MemberUK

Rob I wondered if you had the Blue / Grey chain lorry!
I've only ever seen one, and presume your's is it?
What a stunning piece.
You never cease to amaze me!
Thank you so much for posting.
Chris Warr.

Dinkinius's picture
Dinkinius
Offline
AustraliaDTCA Member

Rob
Your collection of Fodens must be something to see! The blue chain lorry is absolutely stunning! As for the orange and yellow tailboard - words fail me! I bought a 2nd Series Tailboard in deep brown with pale yellow ST hubs years ago, and sold it to a collector in the US. I have regretted that ever since!
Bruce

hoort's picture
hoort
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

Chris, there are more Blue/Grey chain lorries, I have seen at least four more. E.g. the one that was pictured on Ramsay's catalogue is not mine. But I think it is one of the rarest variations. I will give more information about the rivetted back to be able to recognise a fake. That will be in my Foden article. Rob

hoort's picture
hoort
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

Bruce,
The deep brown Tailboard with pale yellow ST hubs, I have never seen or heard of. Do you have a picture or can you reach the collector that bought it from you to provide a picture?
Rob

Dinkinius's picture
Dinkinius
Offline
AustraliaDTCA Member

Rob

Sorry - senility strikes again! I meant chain lorry! See below. The only thing not original was the chain as far as I recall. I will see if I can contact the new owner, if I can find his address as we have had a change of computers since then, and assuming he still has it as he does collect Fodens, and as far as I can recall, he checked it out and was very happy with the model.
And then of course is the following for your interest!

Kind regards
Bruce

hoort's picture
hoort
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

Bruce,
The chain lorry looks dark maroon and the hub colour similar to the
979 Racehorse Transport. My first reaction is to assume a repaint, but as you
and the buyer checked it out, it could well be an original. Interesting!!
Hope you can contact the buyer.
The blue/grey chain lorry looks very nice and original.

Good stuff!
Rob

Dinkinius's picture
Dinkinius
Offline
AustraliaDTCA Member

Rob
The colour was somewhere between dark brown and maroon, but the hubs were identical to the 979.
I was holding my breath in regard to the blue and grey, waiting for your comments!!!:)
Bruce

starni999
Offline
DTCA MemberUK

Hi all,
I've noticed my Mark 2 Chain lorry in Maroon has the dimpled chain posts I normally associate with Mark 1 chain lorries. Makes it an early mark 2? Or is this common?

Mark 1 is on right side of photo.

Cheers
Chris Warr.

buzzer999's picture
buzzer999
Offline
DTCA MemberUK

Here are my Fodens on parade.

They pale into insignificance after seeing Rob's but they are "work in progress"

Dave

hoort's picture
hoort
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

Hi Chris,

Yes, the dimpled chainposts on the 2nd type Foden Chain Lorry make it an early version. 505 2nd type can be found with and without dimpled posts, both in maroon and green. With dimples is mostly found in the matt light blue covered 505 box, which is the earliest type of box for this model.
Kind regards,
Rob

dinkycollect's picture
dinkycollect
Online
DTCA MemberFrance

Rob,

Your blue red flat truck with tailboard is probably an end of run when blue hubs were missing and red hubs available.

hoort's picture
hoort
Offline
DTCA MemberNetherlands

Jacques,
That is very well possible. The combination of French blue with a red flash and
a red body with red wheels make it a real oddity. It was a real surprise to find it.
Rob

dinkyfan's picture
dinkyfan
Offline
DTCA MemberUSA

I don't think I have any rare or unusual Foden's, with the possible exception of the early Flat Truck with Chains version, but I just love the Flat Truck with Tailboard items. Something about that small tailboard just seems to finish off the truck, and to me, make it look even longer than its brother, the Flat Truck. Here are my two Flat Trucks with Tailboard...an early one along with the later version. And has been mentioned, the real trucks were never painted these bright colors, but how we all love them today!
Terry

Pages