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dinkyfan's picture
dinkyfan
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-986 Thornycroft Mighty Antar with Propeller (1959-61)

Another large Supertoy that would have been very popular with young boys when it was brought out in June, 1959. This used the same tractor/cab as the Mighty Antar Tank Transporter, but painted in different colors, and it always came with a driver and windows. The low loader trailer was a design unique to this model, and as such, it did not have a spare tire mounted on top like the military version. The propeller is a plastic material, and it is mounted on a sort of pallet. This is turn is held down on the trailer by means of a thin black flexible cord that runs through holes in the trailer bottom. I believe this was discontinued in 1964, so not very rare, but certainly makes a nice display!
Terry

 

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dinkycollect
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Joined: Fri, 06/26/2015 - 22:49

The low loader with propeller with yellow hubs must be very rare as I could not find a decent picture. Can one post a picture of this rarity ?

Jacques.

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dinkyfan
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Jacques---
Sorry I did not read your post better....I thought you were referring to photos of an actual Mighty Antar with a propeller load, but you were talking about a rare version of the Dinky model with yellow wheels. I have not heard of it......is it documented that some exist?
Terry

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dinkycollect
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Joined: Fri, 06/26/2015 - 22:49

Terry,

There is a misunderstanding, it is the #908 Mighty Antar with transformer which has yellow Supertoys hubs.

There are even boxes showing the yellow hubs.

Now which one came first ? Yellow or red hubs ?

Is there any evidence for a variation with yellow PLASTIC hubs ?

55Zephyr
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Joined: Tue, 07/07/2015 - 02:24

Greetings everybody, especially Terry and Bruce,

It is good to see your pics of this impressive model - hope you will not take offence if I make a slight correction to your comments:

1 The model was introduced in June 1959, but for the first year or so of production did NOT have windows fitted in the cab - if you look closely at Dave's pics you will see that his 986 does not have glazing. I have three examples of this model - one in a box with the date stamp '659 AR' (June 1959, no glazing) - a second in a box with the date stamp 'SM 9 11' (November 1959, also no glazing) and a third in a box with the date stamp '11 60 MR' (November 1960, this time with window glazing).

Of course, there is confusion about it's deletion from the range - Ramsay's shows 1959 to 1961 (incorrect); Richardson quotes 1959 to 1964 (probably correct) and the last reference I can find is in the U.S catalogue for 1963, priced at $4.65.

2 A note about 'Packing Pieces' which is one of my pet topics:

The lower packing piece is self-explanatory, just fitting loose inside the box base. But the upper packing piece as shown by both Terry and Bruce is positioned upside-down! It should be fitted with the scored and folded edges facing upwards like this:

This way it holds the model (relatively) firmly inside the box - but the other way up it doesn't do anything! Meccano were particularly careful to make all their packing very functional but at minimal cost. If you look carefully at this packing piece, you will probably see red paint offset (rubs) on the underside of the card protector showing where it has been in contact with the bonnet and side tanks/toolboxes, as on my example here:

So far I have not seen any boxes with the wording 'With Windows' added to the lid text, but am hopeful that there may be such a box out there somewhere. I hope this information is of interest and may assist in the long-term protection of your low loaders and propellors!

Regards to all, Adrian.

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dinkyfan
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Joined: Tue, 07/07/2015 - 05:27

Adrian--
Thank you so much for pointing us in the right direction! I can't remember where I had read that the Antar with propeller never came without windows, but that was obviously incorrect. And that packing piece sure makes sense. I bought that model years ago, and it is kept in a glass display case, so I had not used the packing for some time when I took the photos...but that should been easy to figure out!
Regards,
Terry

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Dinkinius
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Joined: Tue, 07/07/2015 - 04:38

55Zephyr wrote:
"Greetings everybody, especially Terry and Bruce,

It is good to see your pics of this impressive model - hope you will not take offence if I make a slight correction to your comments:

1 The model was introduced in June 1959, but for the first year or so of production did NOT have windows fitted in the cab - if you look closely at Dave's pics you will see that his 986 does not have glazing. I have three examples of this model - one in a box with the date stamp '659 AR' (June 1959, no glazing) - a second in a box with the date stamp 'SM 9 11' (November 1959, also no glazing) and a third in a box with the date stamp '11 60 MR' (November 1960, this time with window glazing).

Of course, there is confusion about it's deletion from the range - Ramsay's shows 1959 to 1961 (incorrect); Richardson quotes 1959 to 1964 (probably correct) and the last reference I can find is in the U.S catalogue for 1963, priced at $4.65.

2 A note about 'Packing Pieces' which is one of my pet topics:

The lower packing piece is self-explanatory, just fitting loose inside the box base. But the upper packing piece as shown by both Terry and Bruce is positioned upside-down! It should be fitted with the scored and folded edges facing upwards like this: (Image deleted - see actual post)
This way it holds the model (relatively) firmly inside the box - but the other way up it doesn't do anything! Meccano were particularly careful to make all their packing very functional but at minimal cost. If you look carefully at this packing piece, you will probably see red paint offset (rubs) on the underside of the card protector showing where it has been in contact with the bonnet and side tanks/toolboxes, as on my example here:
(Image deleted - see actual post)
So far I have not seen any boxes with the wording 'With Windows' added to the lid text, but am hopeful that there may be such a box out there somewhere. I hope this information is of interest and may assist in the long-term protection of your low loaders and propellors!

Regards to all, Adrian."

Morning Adrian

Many thanks for the advice you have given us. I thought that was the correct manner of inserting the upper packing piece, except on doing this, the end where the propeller is located is above the lower box and therefor the lid does not sit "flat". Apparently the way I have had it has always been thus as the underneath (which would be the upper if fitted correctly!) has slight red rubbings from the Antar's bonnet.

As for the date when glazing was fitted, my record of factory stamps takes the date back one month to October 1960. The last month I have listed without window glazing is July 1960. As for the model's last catalogue/leaflet appearance, it does appear in the May 1963 leaflet but out by the September 1964 leaflet. However, the 986 does appear in the December 1964 13th Edition Catalogue, and twice in the 1965 catalogues with the first being in February 7/265/200 (72557/02) and the final time in the August 1965 catalogue 7/865/135 (2 ptg)) So there we have it - typically Meccano fashion - utter confusion! Out by September 1964 according to the Meccano Toys of Quality leaflet and finally out by catalogue after August 1965. My latest quality stamp is dated October 1961. After this date it appears that quality inspection went out the window as I have found very few from 1962 onwards.

I too have never seen a box marked "With Windows".

Kind regards

Bruce

starni999
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Joined: Thu, 07/09/2015 - 07:19

Hi all,
My no glazing Antar Prop is dated 10 60 R (or B?) E, so October 60 looks good for the last of the none glazed models.
Chris Warr.

55Zephyr
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Greetings everybody,

thanks Terry and Chris, and Bruce for your specific catalogue information. I should have checked my catalogues more carefully! However, my research did produce some interesting information that at the end of production, a few models were made with a detachable loader trailer (in similar fashion to the 660 Antar Tank Transporter) and that these variations are quite scarce. The picture of this model showed it with it's box which still had no mention of 'with windows' so maybe this reference was never included on it's box.

The detachable-trailer model in NM/boxed condition was sold recently by Vectis for

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janwerner
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Joined: Tue, 07/15/2014 - 06:56

There's not much to add to the wealth of information on the 986 here. Three more pictures though, which may be interesting. My example, fitted with windows, bears the stamp 1160MR inside the box lid, so another confirmation that in November 1960 windows were present on this model indeed. The inside also shows traces of red rubbing by the tractor's roof and that the propeller almost caused some penetration of the lid.  This complies with the fact that no upper packing pieces are present in the box. Looking at the pictures shown above it cannot be difficult to reproduce them.

Also, among my pictorial stuff there is an authentic Hausemann & Hötte b/w publicity photo, from the archives of this Dutch Meccano/Dinky Toys agent. They used these for advertisements in newspapers and periodicals and for the 'Na Vijven' magazine, which always included some Meccano Magazine-like pages. I love the simple quality of that image material. It is remarkable that the propeller shown is much more pointed than the final production result. Kind regards, Jan 

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janwerner
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Joined: Tue, 07/15/2014 - 06:56

Some documentary additions, used for my catalogue description work. Meccano Magazine of August 1950 discusses the Antar Low Loader on pages 354-355. Also the second leaflet of the List of moulded jobs and moulding powders (Memo 20927/2, d.d. 6 July 1959), showing the use of polystyrene for the production of the propeller. Kind regards, Jan  

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Dinkinius
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Joined: Tue, 07/07/2015 - 04:38

Thank you Jan for including these additional details, especially the work-sheet for the propeller. Most appreciated.

Seeing that you like contemporary photographs of the real McCoy as mentioned in the 38e Armstrong Siddeley Topic, I am attaching a couple of images for your enjoyment, and hopefully others as well!

These are of the two Antars purchased by the Commonwealth Government of Australia to move extremely heavy items such as turbines etc, associated with the construction of the Snowy Mountains Hydroelectricity Scheme, an immense operation that took almost a quarter century to complete. The project commenced on 17 October 1949 and was officially opened on 21 October 1972 with the final work completed in 1974 - a huge undertaking involving the construction of 16 dams and 10 hydro-electric power stations.145 kilometres (90 mi) of tunnel and 80 kilometres (50 mi) of pipelines and aqueducts. Just 2% of the construction work is visible from above ground. A huge undertaking that surprisingly, came in on budget. (See that happen today!!!)

Also included are several images of my 986 Mighty Antar Low Loader with Propeller. (One of these days I have to throw caution to the wind (as well as my marriage!!) and obtain a 908 Mighty Antar with Transformer!)

Kind regards

Bruce   (150)

20160923/986/1146

 

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dinkyfan
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Joined: Tue, 07/07/2015 - 05:27

Bruce-----Very nice period photos of the Mighty Antar in action. To me, at least, it is still a fascinating piece of equipment that just looks the part. I remember getting my first one as the tank transporter, in 1956, and being very impressed with it. I finally took that plunge you were talking about, and was able to locate and buy a very nice Mighty Antar with Transformer......a couple of years ago. It is quite impressive to get all three versions out together on a table.
Best regards, Terry

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janwerner
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Joined: Tue, 07/15/2014 - 06:56

Those are really great pictures, Bruce, a wonderful and important addition to this thread. And thanks for the clear representation of the upper packing pieces (still puzzling why it's upside down). 

With this model Meccano expressed their interest in maritime matters, as so frequently and extensively confirmed in Meccano Magazine. In my childhood years I lived near the port of Rotterdam and shared the same spectacular views as the Meccano / Dinky Toys designers must have experienced in Liverpool and Merseyside, which undoubtedly led to products like this.

Finally, browsing books and the internet I cannot (yet) find anything about the 'Scimitar' brand / manufacturer. Did any one?

Kind regards, Jan 

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Dinkinius
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Joined: Tue, 07/07/2015 - 04:38

Greetings Adrian

Further to your fine post on 22 December 2014 Post #6 above, advising the correct manner in which the upper cardboard insert is placed, I wish to apologise that the photograph in my last post apparently continues the error of my ways with the insert still incorrectly placed!  Unfortunately, I have not re-photographed my model since August 2014; however, you have my assurance that the upper cardboard insert has now been correctly positioned inside the box for the first time since 1999!

One thing I have noticed, is that correctly positioned, the insert sits a fraction above the bottom half of the box the cause possibly being the propeller itself.  I previously had no problems when the insert was inserted upside down with the little cardboard ring keeping the larger cardboard insert in place and not “flopping around”.  Is it possible my propeller is a reproduction as it does not have the Scimitar transfer or any markings underneath and it may be a fraction taller.  Also my model did not have the usual plastic “ropes” holding the propeller onto its pallet and then the trailer, instead very old, and what looked like hardened, black rubber bands. These unfortunately disintegrated over a decade ago.

Kind regards

Bruce   (150)

20160924/988/1839